Hi there,

I have been reading reviews of Martin Scorcese's new film The Departed. Although 90% of the reviewers excessively laud this film as "one of his greatest achievements" and "a masterpiece" and all those other great kudos. Save for Peter Travers from Rolling Stone, who sounds like as big a Scorcese fan as I am, said this in closing on his review "Issues of sin, redemption, identity and loyalty resonate in Scorsese's films, including the atypical Kundun, Age of Innocence and The Aviator. Each new film absorbs the others, creating a body of work that can stand with the greatest. Scorsese tops the list of American directors because, even when he fails, he strives passionately to make movies that matter. The Departed, a defiantly uncompromised vision of a society rotting from the inside, is one of his best. Act accordingly" Now, that's what I'm saying. It sounded like the other reviewers are only interested in Marty when he does a Taxi Driver or a Raging Bull or a Goodfellas". Many of them said it is his best since Goodfellas or Casino. Now, all you new members can rate your top ten Scorcese films as we discuss the work of America's greatest director who has the reputation as a legend but stilll manages to stay outside the mainstream, regardless of what people say about Gangs of New York and The Aviator, both of which I think were very fine films indeed (my buddy Luis borrowed The Aviator from me because he hadn't seen it and he thought it was fantastic too). Who wants a great director like Scorcese to do the same f-ing thing every film? I sure as hell don't. He takes chances and as Travers said so succinctly he tries to make films that matter. In addition to the three films Travers mentioned, I am going to add Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore and The Last Temptation of Christ and hell, even Bringing Out The Dead. And one more thing, it kind of pisses me off that they diss Gangs so much, I mean, after all Gangs was a film that Marty had wanted make for almost 30 years, so good for him for realizing one of his filmmaking dreams.

1. Taxi Driver 2. Raging Bull 3. Goodfellas (I know it looks like I agree with most of those reviewers, but they are his 3 best films) 4. The Last Temptation of Christ 5. Mean Streets 6. Casino 7. Gangs of New York 8. Kundun 9. Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore 10. After Hours (always had a soft spot for this hilarious romp), but you could just as well put The Aviator or Age of Innocence in this spot. 

"Every day holds a new beginning and every hour holds the promise of an Invitation to Love." 

In my opinion, 'The Last Temtpation of Christ' was a really lame film. I mean that. I'd rate it amongst the top ten worst films I've ever seen. It sort of sits in between 'The Passion' and 'The Life of Brian' but these two films are vastly superior to LTC.

That said, what did you like about it? Why, in your opinion, is it a better film than, for example, 'The Aviator'? Make me understand?

Beauty is momentary in the mind -
The fitful tracing of a portal;
But in the flesh it is immortal.
The body dies; the body's beauty lives.
So evenings die, in their green going,
A wave, interminably flowing.
So gardens die, their meek breath scenting
the cowl of winter, done repenting.
So maidens die, to the auroral
Celebration of a maiden's choral.
Susanna's music touched the bawdy strings
Of those white elders; but, escaping,
Left only Death's ironic scraping.
Now in its immortality, it plays
On the clear viol of her memory,
And makes a constant sacrement of praise.

('Peter Quince at the Clavier' by Wallace Stevens)

"Every day holds a new beginning and every hour holds the promise of an Invitation to Love." 

I am surprised you rate Age of Innocence so low. Personally I am not the biggest fan of Scorsese, actually there was only one film of his I truly admire, that is Taxidriver (hehe, surprise ;-)). But I'd say Age of Innocence is my number two!

Raging Bull was an acting film, meaning the fabulous acting of Deniro was the only merit I have noticed ;-)

Goodefellas didn't get me... somehow bored me rather :-( 

Many others I haven't seen, including the latest ones, Gangs, Aviator...

But Age of Innocence - a beautiful film! In places too heavy for no reason, but all in all it touched something very important, the problem of whether one should or should not sacrifice someone else's happiness for his own (or the other way round!). And the final words where Daniel Day Lewis's son makes him realise that his mother knew and she appreciated that he after all DID sacrifice his happiness for her... that's very moving, at least for me.
Plus all the visual magnificence of the film!

Bobi 1 Kenobi

B. Beware
O. Of
B. BOB 

Smokey, I won't argue with each of your pics but will just single out The Last Temptation of Christ. Maybe it's time to rewatch this pic. Myself, I was rolling in the aisles when I first watched that film! I hadn't been all that keen to see the movie in the first place but there was a lot of controversy around it. When the pickets decided they would show up at the Plitt Theater in Century City, I decided to show some Scorcese solidarity. I hadn't expected a laugh fest -- just subject matter that didn't particularly interest me since I hadn't read the book, which also hadn't intriqued me. It was the "Da Vinci Code" of that time.

I know I went through this once before on the Gazette but two of the most glaring missteps from that movie were Dafoe-Jesus pulling his heart from his chest and Keitel-Judas's New York accent. I was in stitches! Hollywood has never done period pieces very well in my opinion and the further back in historic time they venture, the more comical the results. Not to get too off track but Ken Russell's The Devils had a similar problem when dealing with the Bubonic Plaque of the 14th century. Heaps of bodies being piled onto carts and there's a naked young woman with bikini tan lines. And the Brits do historical drama better! Some faces are just purely 20th century. Barbara Hershey (Seagull) is a case in point.

Martin Scorcese -- gotta love him -- but he has made some gawdawful films. The Aviator? Don't get me started! But you can begin with one of the most wrong-headed examples of casting of all time with Leonardo Di Caprio as Howard Hughes! Boy, I really resented the time wasted watching this movie. Gangs of New York -- Argh! Should have been a Broadway musical. The Color of Money? FEH! By the time this movie came out, I was having serious doubts about Scorcese's future. Kundun? -- The Dalai-ette Lama sorting through the mystical toys was the comedic equivalent of the hav-a-heart scene in LToC. On the plus side, this film does demonstrate why it's a good idea to have a strong military when your neighbor is China. Cape Fear -- oh man, what can I say??? If you're going to remake a minor thriller, why make it less thrilling? Even with the oh-so-naughty teenage Juliette Lewis thumb-sucking scene this one gets a thumbs down in my book. By the end, I wanted to holler, "Just die already, Max Cadie! DIE!!!"

All things considered, Scorcese is more than redeemed with the FABULOUS King of Comedy, Taxi Driver, Mean Streets, Casino, where even Sharon Stone is in top form, and finally, one of the best documentaries of all time -- No Direction Home: Bob Dylan and his part of the triad "New York Stories: Life Lessons." Yes, I too enjoyed The Age of Innocence.  Loved him playing himself on Curb Your Enthusiasm too!

The Departed? I'll wait for the DVD release. Just don't think I can handle Leo who started to lose it for me after the truly great performances in This Boy's Life and What's Eating Gilbert Grape. It may have been an underground fave in Taliban Afghanistan, but Titanic finished off Leo for me once and for all. And don't forget another problem -- -- is in The Departed too. Along with the Greatest Actor in the World, Alec Baldwin.

Oops! Sorry, I guess I did argue with more than one of Smokey's pics. Sigh. And we usually agree on movies. Proving, I suppose, that Scorcese is a divider; not a uniter.

Susan

     
“Half a truth is often a great lie.”

Ben Franklin

Bobi 1 Kenobi

B. Beware
O. Of
B. BOB 

"Every day holds a new beginning and every hour holds the promise of an Invitation to Love." 

That god damn trailer's more popular than Uncle's Day in a whorehouse!

My top five: 

1. Goodfellas - can't really add to the comments above about how good this is. To my dying day, I will always remember being in the cinema watching this and being aware of EVERYONE holding their breath at certain points during it (you can guess which scenes those were!)

2. Taxi Driver - best acting performances ever committed to film? (and that's just from Cybil Shepherd and Marty himself). Although someone should really have told me a bit more about it before I first bought it on VHS many moons ago, and took it round to my mother's to watch for the very first time. Uncomfortable!

3. The King Of Comedy - one of the most underrated films of the past 30 years, faultless (even with Sandra Bernhard in it!) and very funny. Am very suprised that that only one other person has mentioned it here though.

4. Casino - Goodfellas-lite is still better than 95% of the crap I usually endure. Sharon Stone is fantastic in it.

5. Mean Streets - De Niro (check), Keitel (check), sublime soundtrack (check), occasional violence (check), odd stab at humour (you got it!). In other words, a classic Scorcese film!

When Scorcese leaves me cold:

1. Gangs of New York - sorry, was really disappointed in it. It was obvous what points he was trying to make, he just didn't (IMO) execute them very well. The last 30-40 minutes is just one rushed mess. Or maybe it's my allergy to Daniel Day Lewis.

2. The Last Temptation of Christ - I'm not saying I didn't appreciate it, it just sort of passed me by. I can't really fault it for much (acting, sound/music, visuals were all good)

3. The Age of Innocence - see above re DDL; it also just smacked of a desperate attempt to win favour with dear Oscar.

Hoping to see The Departed very soon!

DMG

I hope they cannot see / The limitless potential / Building inside of me / To murder everything / I hope they cannot see / I am the great destroyer

We must have been in different cinemas :-)

No, but seriously I should watch it again. The film completely left me unmoved...
 

Bobi 1 Kenobi

B. Beware
O. Of
B. BOB 

That god damn trailer's more popular than Uncle's Day in a whorehouse!

Saw the Departed and then got a serious martini buzz on at Miller's, See last movie thread for details. About the movie not the martinis

"Every day holds a new beginning and every hour holds the promise of an Invitation to Love." 

I guess Martin Scorcese himself has some thoughts about his films and why he deserves an Oscar. Funny that this article should come along just as the Scorcese Gazette thread!

Susan

     
“Half a truth is often a great lie.”

Ben Franklin

QUOTE:This nuart person is posting articles from The Onion again.

Yeah, but not that often anymore. The Onion is following the path of SNL these days. Losing their edge.

Here's a good 'un from the Wall Street Journal though. I disagree about the wisdom of Scorsese staging a play but still, he has some good points. In the course of this discussion, it brings David Lynch to mind as a counterpoint to Scorsese.

Susan

A Challenge to Martin Scorsese:

If You're Serious About Making Real Art, Throw Away That Checkbook

Terry Teachout

October 28-29, 2006

Martin Scorsese is fed up with Hollywood -- again. Just as "The Departed," his biggest hit in years, was catching fire at the box office, he popped up at a highbrow film festival in Rome, where he informed reporters that he's losing interest in directing blockbuster movies like "Goodfellas" and "Casino." "I think I am finding that when there are very big budgets there is less risk that can be taken," he said. What he wants to do next, Mr. Scorsese claimed, is a small-scale screen version of "Silence," Shusako Endo's 1966 novel about a Jesuit missionary in 17th century Japan -- but he added that if somebody brought him another script as good as "The Departed," he might be tempted to go the big-bucks route again. The desire to make such films, he explained, is "like a disease. It's like a drug."

Not surprisingly, the cynical Hollywood bloggers who write Defamer, the LA Gossip Rag (defamer.com), didn't buy it for one second. "Director Martin Scorsese," they wrote, "is finally figuring out how to make sure people start panting over his wherabouts so much that they offer him carte blanche on his next movie: Announce that you're avoiding studio pictures in favor of a passion project, throw around the word 'risk,' and then immediately back off your statement just in case anyone takes it too seriously."

Far be it from me to doubt the word of a famous film director, but I don't buy it either. "Im looking forward to making pictures that have a little smaller budget and taking different stories and going that way," Mr. Scorsese piously proclaimed after wrapping "The Aviator," his last movie. "If you are going to do something for $100 million, it alters your subject matter and how you present the subject matter." So what did he do next? He signed Matt Damon, Leonardo DiCaprio and Jack Nicholson to star in "The Departed," a $90 millioin shoot-'em-up about a cop who worms his way into the Irish mafia. Very risky, that.

Mr. Scorsese's problem is that working in Hollywood has distorted his sense of artistic values to the point that he thinks it's possible to make "risky" commercial films by spending $20 million instead of $90 million. In fact, there's no longer any such thing as an artistically risky commercial film. Nobody in his right mind would dream of gambling tens of millions of dollars on a movie that isn't carefully calculated to appeal to a mass audience. That means big, star-studded spectacles of one kind or another. Hollywood is built to make such movies -- and even in the absence of commercial pressures, it's much harder to make an artistically serious big movie than an artistically serious small one.

The reason for this is that all great art is ruthlessly selective. It imposes order on the natural world. That's why sonnets have 14 lines and string quaretets are played by four musicians. An art without rules is nothing more than a willful, inchoate stew of random impulses. As Igor Stravinsky put it: "Whatever diminishes constraint diminishes strength. The more constraints one imposes, the more one frees one's self of the chains that shackle the spirit." As the scale of a work of art increases and more people become involved in its creation and execution, it grows steadily more difficult for the artist to exercise the unswerving selectivity that turns chaos into beauty. Large-scale masterpieces like Michelangelo's "Last Judgement," Mahler's "Symphony of a Thousand" or Frank Loyod Wright's Fallingwater can be created only by iron-willed geniuses incapable of compromise -- and with all due respect to Martin Scorsese, he's no Michelangelo.

The limitations that give serious art its concentration and intensity need not be self-imposed, of course. From Whit Stillman's "Metropolitan" to Miranda July's "Me and You and Everyone We Know," most of the truly individual American films of the past quarter-century have been small-scale peroductions made by independent writer-directors who shot them on a shoestring and paid for them by maxing out their credit cards. But my guess is that the 63-year-old Mr. Scorsese is too old, too rich, too famous and too set in his cinematic ways to go for anything like that.

In any case, I have a better idea. If Mr. Scorsese wants to do something really risky, why doesn't he take "Silence" and turn it into a two-man play acted on a bare stage? No helicopters, no tracking shots, no billion-dollar sets -- nothing but whaterver magic the director of "Taxi Driver" is capable of conjuring of of words, light, a half-dozen Japanese screens and a little background music. So far as I know, he's never tried his hand at stage directing. Any regional company in America would gladly give him the opportunity to direct a small scale, low-budget production, and there's not an actor in the world who'd pass up the chance to spend three months working with him. If it was any good, it'd go straight to Broadway and run for a year. If it wasn't, nobody would care but the people who saw it.

So how about it, Mr. Scorsese? Care to roll the dice? Travis Bickle, the demented antihero of "Taxi Driver," was willing to work "anytime, anywhere." Are you? Or would you rather make another gangster movie?

Mr. Teachout, the Journal's drama critic, writes "Sightings" every other Saturday and blogs about the arts at www.terryteachout.com. Write to him at tteachout@wsj.com.

     
“Half a truth is often a great lie.”

Ben Franklin

"Every day holds a new beginning and every hour holds the promise of an Invitation to Love." 

1. The Departed 2. Taxi Driver 3. Goodfellas 4. Casino 5. Age Of Innocence 6. Cape Fear 7. King Of Comedy 8. Raging Bull 9. Mean Streets 10.  Who's That Knocking At My Door