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> Who Is Killing Druggie-Hookers THIS Time?
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| 1. Tuesday, December 12, 2006 8:43 PM |
| nuart |
Who Is Killing Druggie-Hookers THIS Time? |
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That is the question this pyscho-prof addresses in regards to the serial killer on the loose in Suffolk, England. Be careful out there, all ye Brit ladies. This guy may not be able to distinguish between hookers and regular gals. This article cites the Hillside Stranglers who operated in my turf back in the late 70s. They killed a nice clean cut student at Art Center in Pasadena where I too was attending. Some of the other victims were not street walkers either and if memory serves me well, a couple were in their early teens.
Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr. Susan | The Times | December 13, 2006 |
Suffolk murders
He no longer sees himself as a man with a mission but as a serial killer on the run Analysis: David Canter
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|  | We can only look into the mind of the Suffolk murderer by getting some idea of how he came to think of himself as a serial killer. His first murder was likely to be a carefully considered attempt to hide some other crime; killing the victim because she was a crucial witness. He may have held her hostage for any of a number of reasons relating to sex, drugs or other forms of exploitation. Whatever distorted idea he had about the necessity of the killing will have given way to the cold logic of disposing of her body with the minimum evidence to lead back to him. The first killing will not have satisfied his inner demons, but the lack of public interest and the carefully hidden body allowed him to prepare the second murder and body disposal carefully. Getting away with the second crime must have given him further confidence, and even a belief that his murders were smiled on by the fates. But as the pressures build from the massive police investigation and media interest, he can no longer take the precautions he originally did. The subsequent victims were disposed of more quickly and in a less careful manner. His concern is no longer to get rid of evidence that would link him to the murders but to keep the police away from his door. He no longer thinks of himself as a man with a mission but as a serial killer on the run. The body count, and the ways in which the bodies have been disposed of, indicates a fiendish determination that is so rarely seen in Britain that all the deaths are very likely to be the product of the same evil mind. But these victims would have been street-wise in many different senses. They are unlikely to have been easy prey to abduct. It therefore has to be possible that even if there was one evil mind behind this he had a willing assistant. Finding five murdered women in such a short space of time in a similar area is exceedingly rare, but not unknown. However, we have to go to the US, more than a quarter of a century ago, to find a similar case. During October 1977 the bodies of three women, which had been cleaned of all scientific evidence, were found around Los Angeles. There were seven further, similar, killings over two years until Ken Bianchi and Angelo Buono, the “Hillside Stranglers”, were arrested. These men had abducted street prostitutes by pretending to be police officers and then taken them back to their house where they sexually assaulted and tortured them. Importantly, the Hillside killers had left the bodies in an area around the house in which the victims had been held. The close proximity of the bodies in Suffolk must therefore be a matter of urgent consideration for the investigative team. What brought the offender to this area? Is it a place he knew from more innocent activities? Or is he trying to put a distance between his base and the victims’ bodies? If so, how far would he think was an appropriate distance? The murders in Suffolk may have some of the hallmarks of the Hillside murders but, fortunately, such murders are so uncommon that we have to be very careful before assuming that a pattern is being repeated. So many victims over such a short time may be more a product of the opportunities for finding vulnerable victims in Ipswich rather than the studied horror of Bianchi and Buono. A series of murders such as this do have to be distinguished, though, from the spree killers such as Michael Ryan in Hungerford who killed 16 people in a morning in August 1987, or the Columbine school shooting. Spree killers almost invariably end up killing themselves or putting themselves in the line of fire. Their actions are really a desperate anger with themselves and the particular sub-group whom they feel have so demeaned them. The much more carefully planned abduction, murder and stripping of victims, whose availability is best known to men who use street prostitutes, is not a spree killer’s fury with anyone in his path. There is a cold calculation to these crimes in Suffolk that means the killer, or killers, by now will have thought through how best to avoid detection. He will be deeply interested in the police inquiry, but be at pains to avoid drawing attention to himself. As the international media interest grows he may be tempted to reveal his hand some more, but is more likely to be driven further underground. Any call from the police for the murderer to give himself up is an understandable gesture. But neither remorse, nor personal insight into the gravity of his violence, are likely to characterise this killer. Instead the police will have the task of filtering out all the disturbed, or silly, individuals who seek some distorted glory, or confused expiation of their imagined sins, by confessing to the police for crimes they have not committed. The sad fact is that in the past serial killings against victims with whom the offender had no obvious connections have usually been solved by the killer making a mistake. Peter Sutcliffe, the Yorkshire Ripper, was apprehended when stopped for a minor crime by a local bobby. Bianchi was caught for killings not initially associated with the hillside murders when he was known to have been seen with a woman reported as missing. Nowadays, with automatic numberplate recognition and closed-circuit television footage, as well as the great developments in forensic science, it is much easier for even the most careful criminals to leave identifying traces. We must hope that they are already helping the police to close in on the killer. Professor David Canter is director for the Centre of Investigative Psychology, University of Liverpool. His most recent book, Mapping Murder, is published by Virgin Books | | |
“Half a truth is often a great lie.” Ben Franklin
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| 2. Tuesday, December 12, 2006 6:18 PM |
| one suave folk |
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Horrible whether they're junkies, hoes, whatever... But this is a grammar issue. It should be "who's" (as in "who is" contracted), not "whose". Come on, Susan, did you set that one up just for me?
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| 3. Tuesday, December 12, 2006 6:59 PM |
| Booth |
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| QUOTE: Horrible whether they're junkies, hoes, whatever... But this is a grammar issue. It should be "who's" (as in "who is" contracted), not "whose". Come on, Susan, did you set that one up just for me? |
If you put the title of that Drew Carey improv show in a translator, translate it into German, then into Japanese, then into Korean, and last back into English, you get the title of this thread.
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| 4. Tuesday, December 12, 2006 8:30 PM |
| nuart |
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| QUOTE: Horrible whether they're junkies, hoes, whatever... But this is a grammar issue. It should be "who's" (as in "who is" contracted), not "whose". Come on, Susan, did you set that one up just for me? |
Know whey Ied jok u lik thatt, Chris!
Susan
“Half a truth is often a great lie.” Ben Franklin
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| 5. Friday, December 15, 2006 4:59 PM |
| LetsRoque |
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Did you hear about the dyslexic Santa from suffolk?
He kept leavin prossies under trees :-)
'I look for an opening, do you understand?'
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| 6. Saturday, December 16, 2006 6:01 AM |
| Flangella |
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Latest from BBC News There's so many jokes doing the rounds about this at the moment and I just keep wondering why their lives are worth less because they're prostitutes? Sorry but I just don't think there's anything amusing about it at all... 
My theory by A. Elk, brackets, Miss, brackets. This theory goes as follows and begins now. All brontosauruses are thin at one end, much much thicker in the middle, and then thin again at the far end. That is my theory, it is mine, and it belongs to me, and I own it, and what it is, too. Ange's Odyssey
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| 7. Saturday, December 16, 2006 11:29 AM |
| LetsRoque |
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| QUOTE: Latest from BBC News There's so many jokes doing the rounds about this at the moment and I just keep wondering why their lives are worth less because they're prostitutes? Sorry but I just don't think there's anything amusing about it at all... |
Sorry for my tasteless joke. But my philosophy is, If you didn't laugh you'd cry. If it happened one of my loved ones obviously I'd think different. I can't speak for anyone else on the thread but my indifference comes down to the fact that it didn't happen on my doorstep. Blame the modern media. Its the 'nothing ever happens in chile' effect of media remoteness. Its not the fact they are prostitutes because personally I don't see herione/crack addicted prostitutes as any lesser people than me, we all have our faults. Say for argument's sake if it happened in Susan's back yard (LA) would you be just as sensitive?
'I look for an opening, do you understand?'
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| 8. Saturday, December 16, 2006 2:27 PM |
| Flangella |
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To be honest with you I didn't think I was being that sensitive, just saying I didn't find it funny. I know in this life you do have to laugh to get through a lot of things, but if the same thing was happening in LA then I would be just as saddened to hear about it. I suppose I just can't get my head around why anyone wants to, or thinks they have the right to, take another life.
My theory by A. Elk, brackets, Miss, brackets. This theory goes as follows and begins now. All brontosauruses are thin at one end, much much thicker in the middle, and then thin again at the far end. That is my theory, it is mine, and it belongs to me, and I own it, and what it is, too. Ange's Odyssey
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| 9. Saturday, December 16, 2006 6:04 PM |
| Fred |
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I think Flangella is right to feel saddened by it. It's a terrible thing to happen, and I don't see the joke either. I just hope they find whoever did it, before he kills someone else.
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| 10. Saturday, December 16, 2006 6:18 PM |
| Fred |
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I think Flangella is right to feel saddened by it. It's a terrible thing to happen, and I don't see the joke either. I just hope they find whoever did it, before he kills someone else.
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| 11. Saturday, December 16, 2006 8:57 PM |
| nuart |
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I meant the distinction as a warning for the upstanding young British ladies on the Gazette to stay clear of the Ipswich Ripper. Rippers do not know who's a junkie or a hooker. They seek targets of opportunity. Drug-addled streetwalkers are -- and have always been -- the most convenient victims for serial killers. It's always sad to see young prostitutes walking the streets. Drugs and/or alcohol are usually part of the whole tragic downward spiral. Rippers are a known occupational hazard as well. Susan
“Half a truth is often a great lie.” Ben Franklin
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| 12. Monday, December 18, 2006 9:55 AM |
| nuart |
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Alright, ladies of Ipswich! Seems it may now be safe again to walk the streets of your neighborhood after 5 of your sisters have been murdered by the criminal with the Nom de Tabloid "The Ipswich Ripper." Police have a suspect under arrest today. Thomas Stephens, I believe was his name. He's 37 years old (just about the right age for a serial killer) and is said to have known all five of the victims. Now that part is a little unusual, I think. Usually these fellows are a little more cagey, targeting and stalking strangers of opportunity. Police are searching his home today for evidence but I'm wondering if they may be on the wrong track. Maybe Thomas Stephens was just a frequenter of the ladies' services? Maybe a mere vendor of pharmaceuticals used by the women in question? Maybe all three. The Brits are usually so tight-lipped about criminal arrests that we may have to wait and see. If this were a US story, all the evidence would have been leaked to the press by now. Susan
“Half a truth is often a great lie.” Ben Franklin
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| 13. Monday, December 18, 2006 11:35 AM |
| Flangella |
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Latest news about the man being held
My theory by A. Elk, brackets, Miss, brackets. This theory goes as follows and begins now. All brontosauruses are thin at one end, much much thicker in the middle, and then thin again at the far end. That is my theory, it is mine, and it belongs to me, and I own it, and what it is, too. Ange's Odyssey
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| 14. Monday, December 18, 2006 12:22 PM |
| nuart |
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Just listened to that interview, Flangie! "Special friend!" Oh yeah, I'm pretty sure this guy is guilty. What a cool cucumber he is but is having a blast talking about it. Blab fest! He's acting like he's an FBI profiler-slash-detective helping to solve the crime. He's embarrassed that the word "prostitute" is used. He can't bear his name to be used in the same sentence with the word "prostitute." He's ashamed of that. After all, these were "friends." Some of these "friends" had "clients." It seems as if he met some of the girls through myspace. Susan
“Half a truth is often a great lie.” Ben Franklin
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| 15. Tuesday, December 19, 2006 2:03 AM |
| Flangella |
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| QUOTE: Just listened to that interview, Flangie! "Special friend!" Oh yeah, I'm pretty sure this guy is guilty. What a cool cucumber he is but is having a blast talking about it. Blab fest! He's acting like he's an FBI profiler-slash-detective helping to solve the crime. He's embarrassed that the word "prostitute" is used. He can't bear his name to be used in the same sentence with the word "prostitute." He's ashamed of that. After all, these were "friends." Some of these "friends" had "clients." It seems as if he met some of the girls through myspace. Susan |
I completely agree that he's guilty, I think when you see him he has that potential look in his eyes...and like you say, he's too cool about it all. And anyone that gets that guilty about the word "prostitute" has a problem with the profession as it is. Maybe he thought he was "saving" them because they were his "friends"? Who knows what goes on in the mind of a psycho?! Although it looks like he may have had an accomplice: Latest News
My theory by A. Elk, brackets, Miss, brackets. This theory goes as follows and begins now. All brontosauruses are thin at one end, much much thicker in the middle, and then thin again at the far end. That is my theory, it is mine, and it belongs to me, and I own it, and what it is, too. Ange's Odyssey
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| 16. Thursday, December 21, 2006 7:02 PM |
| nuart |
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Hmmm, Flangie, it looks like they released creepy Tom on bail! The other guy has been charged with murder. Well, this is interesting! I knew there were more reasons than one to avoid cruise ships. This guy was a steward on the QE2. Susan Man, 48, charged with murder of five women
By Lee Glendinning The Independent
Published: 22 December 2006
Stephen Wright, a forklift driver from Ipswich, has been charged with murdering five women who were working as prostitutes and whose naked bodies had been found within 10 miles of the town earlier this month.
Mr Wright, 48, a former steward on the QE2, has been questioned by police since he was arrested in the early hours of Tuesday morning at his home on London Road.
He will appear at Ipswich Magistrates' court this morning charged with the murder of Gemma Adams, 25; Anneli Alderton, 24; Tania Nicol, 19; Paula Clennell, 24, and Annette Nicholls, 29.
Tom Stephens, the 37-year-old supermarker worker who was the first man arrested on suspicion of murder, was last night released without charge on police bail.
Investigators have been undergoing a meticulous search of Mr Wright's two-bedroomed flat, which is within an Edwardian conversion, and is situated on one of the roads bordering the red light district. They have also seized his car.
Detective Chief Superintendent Stewart Gull said last night: "You will be aware that, on Monday 18 December, as part of our investigation into the murders of five women in the Ipswich area, we arrested a suspect at his home address in Trimley St Martin.
"The next day, Tuesday 19 December, a second suspect was arrested in Ipswich. There have been significant inquiries and interviews during the period that these men have been in custody.
"As a result of these inquiries, the 37-year-old man from Trimley has been released on police bail pending further inquiries. The second man, Stephen Wright from Ipswich, has been charged with the murder of all five women."
Mr Wright's girlfriend of five years, Pamela Wright, 48, who moved to the flat with him three months ago, has protested his innocence since he was arrested.
Acquaintances have described Mr Wright as a golf fanatic and a shy man, although some press reports this week have carried information about his alleged penchant for cross-dressing.
Mr Stephens, a Tesco worker and former special constable arrested on Monday morning, had aroused police suspicion following an interview he gave to the Sunday Mirror. He said in the interview that he had already been questioned by police four times but said he was not worried about being charged as he was innocent.
The bodies of the five women had all been found in rural settings between 2 December and 12 December. Some had been dumped in water and all were found naked save for their jewellery.
Michael Crimp, senior prosecutor for the Crown Prosecution Service in Suffolk, said yesterday: "We have been working with officers from Suffolk Constabulary for the past eight days advising on a number of preliminary legal issues before and after arrest.
"This evening, we have made the decision that there is sufficient evidence and authorised that Stephen Wright, born on 24 April 1958, of London Road, Ipswich, should be charged with the murders. We will continue to keep this case under constant review as it develops."
Mr Wright, was born in Erpingham in Norfolk and spent his early years at RAF Beckham where his father, Conrad, was a corporal. The family moved to Felixstowe, Suffolk, in the early 1980s, when his father took a job as a docks policeman.
Mr Wright is divorced from his first wife Angela, with whom he is believed to have three children, all of whom are now grown up.
Later, Mr Wright returned to Norfolk and ran a pub in Norwich with his second wife Diane, whom he married in 1987. The pair have since divorced and she has now remarried.
Mr Wright's most recent work was as a forklift truck driver on the Felixstowe docks, while his current girlfriend Pamela is understood to work nights at a call centre in the town.
The investigation began on 30 October when Tania Nicol, the youngest victim, disappeared.
“Half a truth is often a great lie.” Ben Franklin
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| 17. Friday, December 22, 2006 1:50 AM |
| LetsRoque |
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QUOTE: | QUOTE: Just listened to that interview, Flangie! "Special friend!" Oh yeah, I'm pretty sure this guy is guilty. What a cool cucumber he is but is having a blast talking about it. Blab fest! He's acting like he's an FBI profiler-slash-detective helping to solve the crime. He's embarrassed that the word "prostitute" is used. He can't bear his name to be used in the same sentence with the word "prostitute." He's ashamed of that. After all, these were "friends." Some of these "friends" had "clients." It seems as if he met some of the girls through myspace. Susan |
I completely agree that he's guilty, I think when you see him he has that potential look in his eyes...and like you say, he's too cool about it all. And anyone that gets that guilty about the word "prostitute" has a problem with the profession as it is. Maybe he thought he was "saving" them because they were his "friends"? Who knows what goes on in the mind of a psycho?! Although it looks like he may have had an accomplice: Latest News
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That first guy was released without charge. Just goes to show you what trial by media achieves. The mainstream press have been a disgrace throughout this whole episode. The first guy was blatently a loser looking for attention. The media, and subsequently the public, assume because of his 'creepy eyes' or whatever that he fits the bill and therefore is guilty. Just as well the police didn't lose focus throughout this witchhunt and concentrated on making sure they got their man. Thats not to say this second guy 'the accomplice' isn't innocent either but it looks like they have alot more evidence than the ramblings of a madman.
In any event, since this story broke over 2 weeks ago, it has had constant headline status. I shudder to think how many have been raped and killed in Darfur during the same period.
'I look for an opening, do you understand?'
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| 18. Friday, December 22, 2006 12:09 PM |
| Flangella |
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I have a couple of friends who have accounts on MySpace and the first chap who was arrested messaged them both; they said the content of the message was "quite freaky" and it appears that he had messaged everyone on there just to try and get some friends. That, and just a gut instinct about him, led me to feel he was guilty. Obviously I was wrong and I'll be the first to admit that.
My theory by A. Elk, brackets, Miss, brackets. This theory goes as follows and begins now. All brontosauruses are thin at one end, much much thicker in the middle, and then thin again at the far end. That is my theory, it is mine, and it belongs to me, and I own it, and what it is, too. Ange's Odyssey
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| 19. Friday, December 22, 2006 11:43 AM |
| nuart |
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Let's not leap to un-conclusions quite yet, kids. He was not quite released without charges -- he was released ON BAIL. If there were no suspicion still focusing on Stephens, he would not have had to pay bail.
Flangie, I hope none of your friends would arrange a meeting with Tommy boy, all the same. There was something in his tone that brought to mind that guy who recently falsely confessed to killing Jon Benet Ramsey, though, wasn't there? What's the point of bringing up the murder-rapes in Darfur, James? You know the old cardinal rule of journalism -- dog bites man versus man bites dog? News travels in concentric circles outward. Okay, granted there's a licentious quality when the subject matter is dead nude young women. But lest we forget, it was a fictional dead nude young woman who brought us all together here. If that subject didn't spark human interest, well, much of literature and film's basic themes would be lost.
How completely natural is it, that local news would feature a story of a serial killer on the loose in an English town? Conversely, how completely obvious is it that most Western journalists are loathe to take their lives in their hands, throwing all caution to the sand storm, in order to risk travel to Sudan to cover a brutal genocide? Were there journalists doing so -- and were they regularly able to get their video footage out -- AND survive, trust me, you'd have your nightly dose of Darfur news. There need to be images though. Wherever the worst atrocities are commited -- frequently on the African continent -- a blue vest reading "PRESS" is no guarantee of survival. In fact, that blue vest reads more like a target. But you knew all that.
Btw, I haven't seen a thing on the Ipswich murders on US TV, but we've got bigger fish to fry. You see, Donald Trump gave the carousing Miss USA a second chance, she went into rehab, Rosie O'Donnell made fun of the Donald and then the Donald called Rosie a fat slob and threatened to sue her for saying he went bankrupt. Serial killers in Ipswich? Not enough time in our 24 hour cable news programming for those small potaters. Susan
“Half a truth is often a great lie.” Ben Franklin
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| 20. Friday, December 22, 2006 1:08 PM |
| LetsRoque |
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In the grand scheme of things I just don't see the big deal. Most people I talk to feel the same yet turn on your tv and this is consistently headline news. It doesn't really affect anybody outside Suffolk nevermind England. I want my news back.
'I look for an opening, do you understand?'
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| 21. Friday, December 22, 2006 1:28 PM |
| nuart |
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I'm with you, baby! Everyday when I watch the "News" I ask myself, isn't there someone in charge telling these people NOT to cover this story or to cover this one? Seriously, two days ago, I awakened to turn on the TV as I do each morning as I feed Lola the lab breakfast in bed. She eats her weight reduction kibble from my hand and I watch the early morning news. On CNN, FOX, MSNBC and ABC, CBS, and NBC -- all of 'em! -- LIVE BREAKING NEWS. There were cameramen and Johnny-and-Jill on the spot 'journalists' swarming around in front of a building in New York awaiting the arrival of Tara Conner. WHO??? I asked myself. Miss USA, that's who. Would the Donald tell her, "You're fired!" as expected, all the giddy reporters wanted to know. Next we have LIVE coverage of Donald Trump at a podium explaining that Tara, with her good heart, would be given a second chance and could keep her crown after a trip to the celeb requisite rehab. After that, a teary speech from poor Miss USA. The all-channel news coverage continued!!! Stunning! But it didn't end there. The "journalists" had questions. About her underage drinking, her drug testing, her "relationship" with Miss Teen USA with whom she shares an apartment and much more according to the "news." They had been seen smooching in nightclubs. She cried and cried again. Donald took back the microphone and someone off camera handed her the Miss USA whatchamagigger that she draped across her chest. It was official now! Was there not ONE network executive who felt this was not worthy of bringing a screeching halt to any real news in order to broadcast this silly story? Nope.
Now is the time for all good men/women to come to the aid of their... That's how I learned to type. Now is the time for all good media outlets (there must be one!) to come to their senses and have a more meaningful scaling of what is news and what is entertainment. Please, please, please stop with anchor-men/women banter too while we're at it. How about a new concept -- a program with news delivered without the editorializing or banter between attractive know-nothings assigned to read the monitor? I have no idea how your news programs work, James, but ours has become a shameful embarrassment. I freely admit this. Susan
“Half a truth is often a great lie.” Ben Franklin
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| 22. Friday, December 22, 2006 1:47 PM |
| LetsRoque |
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Well I turned on the news tonight and the reporters were out in force in car parks across the land asking random people if they knew were the fog light switch was situated in their cars...you see its quite foggy over here at the mo. Definitely a slow news day!
'I look for an opening, do you understand?'
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| 23. Friday, December 22, 2006 2:10 PM |
| nuart |
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Fog lights! That's a good one! Here in LA IF and WHEN it rains, the opening news story on the 11:00 pm news is always "Storm Watch!!!" They will have some reporter with a parka and an umbrella standing on a hillside in Malibu talking about how she feels a little drizzle and how the rains are a'comin'. It's pitiful! This can go on a full 10 minutes with the resulting traffic jams. There are also numerous interviews with the man on the street -- "How do you like this weather?" "Well, I don't like it but I guess we do need the rain." Sooooo important! It's not like any of us couldn't look out the window to know it's raining! But apparently rain in LA is a man bites dog story.
Susan
“Half a truth is often a great lie.” Ben Franklin
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